I love this addition! And I am relieved (funny thing to say maybe but true) that you have different interpretations - or things you take away from this powerful quote. As with all of your pieces, that nuance leaves more room for wondering - which I need right now. Thank you.
Glad you like it, Peggy. We think it's going to be a nice addition. Yes, slightly different takes. We tried hard to argue/disagree on a previous one. We'll keep trying, right, Zan? No, Pa!!!!
I too like this new set of discussions. Personally I am not fond of the ladder image which insinuates a top and a bottom. This maybe a personal problem coming from being told I was always supposed to be at the top of the ladder. I like the image of a path and a path that only leads one back to oneself. I also like the idea of Buddha Nature (or any other term for the divine) which is always present in all of us and only are own ignorance keeps us from knowing it and acting from it.
Thanks, Hal. I think all these images are paradoxical. There is the idea of climbing, of improving, of changing, but the climb, improvement, or change ultimately leads us 'back' to our true self, the part that was always there. I like the Buddhist image of a dusty mirror. You work to clean off the dust so you can see who you actually are. On the one hand, why work, since you were always there. On the other hand, if you don't work, don't climb, don't tread the path, don't change, you won't see that divine you clearly, or won't see it at all.
What I'm drawn to in this quotation is the brightness of the word initiation, characterizing the stages of life we enter, one after another, like the rungs of ladders we climb. Because initiation can only occur with what's new in our lives, there's brightness in the simple suggestion of the stages being new, lands as yet uncharted, lands of promise. We're initiated into the new, not the old; into the unknown, not the known; into light, not dark. Initiation further suggests brightness through the metaphor of climbing ladders, a metaphor of ascendancy, of rising from below. We ascend into light, not dark.
Were the stages to which we transition old and dark, initiation wouldn't work as the word to characterize the transitions. Nor would the metaphor of climbing ladders. Another word would be needed, a word with bleaker connotations, something like descent. And another metaphor would be needed, again with bleaker connotations, something like sinking in the sea. (I grew up on Long Island Sound, as you know, and so I'm prone to saltwater metaphors.)
I remember an especially dark moment in my life, having suffered a major loss. A friend said to me I was now beginning my life beyond that loss, a perspective I found helpful in its brightness, countering the dark; or, more precisely, brightness reconceptualizing the emotional landscape of what was dark, envisioning it as a place from which to depart, rather than a place to which to return. Of course, the reconceptualization requires the strength to constantly live on that landscape, when it's easier to return. We can never forget. Nor should we. Still, my friend's perspective was one of initiation.
A curious quotation, and an engaging addition to Hi Zan, Hi Pa, this series of quotations.
Thank you, Bob, for another great response. I've read this book multiple times and have always been fascinated by his use of the word 'initiation'. He often uses it in a technical sense--a Sufi seeker initiated by a Sufi master. But then he goes on to talk about how life initiates all of us, or can initiate us if we are open to it. I think this quote--and Zan's comment on it--focus on that big 'if'. It takes a certain kind of courage and exertion to even want to, or try to, climb that ladder. What your friend said to you pointed to exactly that: in the darkest hours, to have the courage not to give up, not to be 'pulled back' as Khan puts it, but to keep trying to go forward. I've mentioned many times the remark that the famous Zen master Sohn San made, "Try, only try." Hard to keep trying sometimes and, as Khan puts it, you should not wake up someone who wants to stay asleep. Let them wake up on their own schedule. Let them not try if they don't want to. Just too painful for me not to try.
I love this addition! And I am relieved (funny thing to say maybe but true) that you have different interpretations - or things you take away from this powerful quote. As with all of your pieces, that nuance leaves more room for wondering - which I need right now. Thank you.
Glad you like it, Peggy. We think it's going to be a nice addition. Yes, slightly different takes. We tried hard to argue/disagree on a previous one. We'll keep trying, right, Zan? No, Pa!!!!
I too like this new set of discussions. Personally I am not fond of the ladder image which insinuates a top and a bottom. This maybe a personal problem coming from being told I was always supposed to be at the top of the ladder. I like the image of a path and a path that only leads one back to oneself. I also like the idea of Buddha Nature (or any other term for the divine) which is always present in all of us and only are own ignorance keeps us from knowing it and acting from it.
Thanks, Hal. I think all these images are paradoxical. There is the idea of climbing, of improving, of changing, but the climb, improvement, or change ultimately leads us 'back' to our true self, the part that was always there. I like the Buddhist image of a dusty mirror. You work to clean off the dust so you can see who you actually are. On the one hand, why work, since you were always there. On the other hand, if you don't work, don't climb, don't tread the path, don't change, you won't see that divine you clearly, or won't see it at all.
Zanny and Roland,
What I'm drawn to in this quotation is the brightness of the word initiation, characterizing the stages of life we enter, one after another, like the rungs of ladders we climb. Because initiation can only occur with what's new in our lives, there's brightness in the simple suggestion of the stages being new, lands as yet uncharted, lands of promise. We're initiated into the new, not the old; into the unknown, not the known; into light, not dark. Initiation further suggests brightness through the metaphor of climbing ladders, a metaphor of ascendancy, of rising from below. We ascend into light, not dark.
Were the stages to which we transition old and dark, initiation wouldn't work as the word to characterize the transitions. Nor would the metaphor of climbing ladders. Another word would be needed, a word with bleaker connotations, something like descent. And another metaphor would be needed, again with bleaker connotations, something like sinking in the sea. (I grew up on Long Island Sound, as you know, and so I'm prone to saltwater metaphors.)
I remember an especially dark moment in my life, having suffered a major loss. A friend said to me I was now beginning my life beyond that loss, a perspective I found helpful in its brightness, countering the dark; or, more precisely, brightness reconceptualizing the emotional landscape of what was dark, envisioning it as a place from which to depart, rather than a place to which to return. Of course, the reconceptualization requires the strength to constantly live on that landscape, when it's easier to return. We can never forget. Nor should we. Still, my friend's perspective was one of initiation.
A curious quotation, and an engaging addition to Hi Zan, Hi Pa, this series of quotations.
Thanks, Bob
Thank you, Bob, for another great response. I've read this book multiple times and have always been fascinated by his use of the word 'initiation'. He often uses it in a technical sense--a Sufi seeker initiated by a Sufi master. But then he goes on to talk about how life initiates all of us, or can initiate us if we are open to it. I think this quote--and Zan's comment on it--focus on that big 'if'. It takes a certain kind of courage and exertion to even want to, or try to, climb that ladder. What your friend said to you pointed to exactly that: in the darkest hours, to have the courage not to give up, not to be 'pulled back' as Khan puts it, but to keep trying to go forward. I've mentioned many times the remark that the famous Zen master Sohn San made, "Try, only try." Hard to keep trying sometimes and, as Khan puts it, you should not wake up someone who wants to stay asleep. Let them wake up on their own schedule. Let them not try if they don't want to. Just too painful for me not to try.